Unknown Theories Podcast

Mando Grogu Flop? Invincible and Doomsday Discussion! Ep 64

• Taylor & Kris • Episode 64

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Welcome to the Unknown Theories Podcast! Taylor and Kris are back at it again covering all things nerdy from Star Wars to Marvel and everything in-between. 
In today's episode we look at the lack of buzz surrounding Star Wars the Mandalorian and Grogu which arrives May 22nd. A box office bomb looms over the fearless bounty hunter and his baby Yoda in training. Invincible episode seven showed audiences Thragg's strength and predictions are made for this seasons final. Beyond that Doomsday remains a mystery but many a theory and behind the scenes rumor is discussed especially with the Cinema Con trailer causing quite the stir. Let us know what you think! We'd love to hear from you. Until next time may Thragg protect you and Argall guide you. May the Force be with you!


Check us out on YouTube and Twitch:

https://www.youtube.com/@StarWarsOddball

https://www.youtube.com/@yoslo6832

https://www.twitch.tv/yoslo1

https://www.twitch.tv/starwarsoddball

SPEAKER_01

Hey everybody, welcome back to the Unknown Theories podcast. I'm Joslo.

SPEAKER_00

I'm Odball.

SPEAKER_01

And today we're going to be talking about a few topics. Why don't you say what those topics are?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, uh, so we're going to be talking about the Mandalorian and Grogu because it just released its final trailer about four days ago as of this recording. Um, and you know, being a Star Wars content creator, I thought it would be pertinent for me to address some concerns and the uh fan community around this movie. And uh I think I think it'd be cool to get some maybe some predictions on the box office and how this movie's gonna do in theaters. And we talk about kind of uh some some behind-the-scenes stuff and like why it's even a movie.

SPEAKER_01

Uh and then we're also gonna be something I don't know. Star Wars fans complaining.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. Alright. I mean, ever since Last Jedi. Yeah, so um Invincible had uh a pretty dope episode seven. Episode eight will be coming out Wednesday, which is probably the day that this is gonna come out. Um, so we won't be talking about the finale, but you can uh be rest assured we will be talking about a full season review uh and talk about the finale uh after this. Uh but I think it would be cool to talk about Thrag and then uh also address um you know things that we like about the season so far and maybe some uh stuff that we don't like and then uh what we think is gonna go down in episode eight. Uh and then of moving into uh Doomsday, uh we we know that Avengers Doomsday is gonna be coming out uh later this year, around the same time as um Dune. And so I want to talk a little bit about the Cinemacon trailer as well as the um Infinite uh Infinity Vision, I think is what it's called, that Disney's uh planning on doing. So maybe we can uh talk about that stuff, but uh yeah, uh kind of just some preamble. How are you doing, bro?

SPEAKER_01

Doing good. Actually, I just thought of something. I heard a casting on Batman 2. Um Charles Dance, who uh famously was in Game of Thrones as Tywin Lannister. Um speaking on a role. I don't know what role. I did not look to see what role he's gonna be playing. You saw that he's gonna be in it. I see you got your cloak on too.

SPEAKER_00

Sorry, I just wanted to for audio listeners, he's got a dope cloak.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, feel free to jump over to the YouTube channel to see what it looks like. I got this at Night Weave. Pretty cool.

SPEAKER_00

Uh and then yeah, I should uh I should be sending these over to you so you can put them on your YouTube channel if you'd like um these podcasts. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I I I'm fine, you know, if I don't upload it or something. Uh, but but if I can, that also is cool. Um I will say I just just looked it up, and apparently he is going to be playing the role of Christopher Dent, father to the Gotham District Attorney Harvey Dent.

SPEAKER_00

Interesting.

SPEAKER_01

How does that Harvey Dent is supposedly gonna be played by Sebastian Stan?

SPEAKER_00

Yes, that's right. I remember that rumor.

SPEAKER_01

And then Scarlet Johansson is also on board and rumored to be playing Dent's wife Gilda.

SPEAKER_00

Hmm. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01

So I guess they're just gonna have the whole family. That's pretty sweet. Um, but yeah, I mean, Charles Dance is a great actor, and yeah, that'll be cool to see.

SPEAKER_00

I'm excited for that movie. I'm like kind of bummed because you know, James Gunn has a different plan for Batman in his DCU. Um but I do like Matt Reeves' uh Gotham universe that he's created. It's just you know, it would be tricky um trying to make it succinct, but I think I think people are comfortable enough with Batman being rebooted that they're not like, what the heck? Like I just I know that I know people really do like uh that those movies, at least that movie, that one movie.

SPEAKER_01

And the penguin was a hit as well. Yes, it was, yeah. Um even if it didn't have the you know, if it might not have had the big best viewers. That's actually something I was gonna ask.

SPEAKER_00

It had pretty solid viewership.

SPEAKER_01

Um but I would say that like viewership and also money made in the box office does not determine how good a movie is, in my opinion. No. Um I was gonna say like if Avengers Endgame came out and did not make 2.7 billion but made 500 million, but it was the exact same movie, exact same movie.

SPEAKER_00

I mean, we would like it, but it would the Infinity Saga would be considered more of a failure. Um if the finale to the Infinity Saga only made 500 million, we'd probably be like, what the frick? Like you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01

What if every single movie in the whole thing made 500 million?

SPEAKER_00

Well then I think that would be I mean it would it would still I'm sure some people would still say it was a failure because they're like this is the finale, it should be like the biggest one.

SPEAKER_01

No one thought it would get as much as it did though.

SPEAKER_00

No. I I don't think I think in retrospect, um, you know, we look back on the Infinity Saga and we're like, well, yeah, it was amazing. But at the time, like everything was so like each time a movie was a massive hit, we were just like, Oh my gosh, dude, like they can't be stopped. And uh um I don't think we like quite realized how special the Infinity Saga was in the moment. It was a different time for sure. Yeah, it was.

SPEAKER_01

It was. I feel uh what was I doing? I think I was walking home from my job when I still worked at this other school that was close to my old house. And I actually was walking home. I don't remember why I was walking home, but I remember I was listening to a podcast talk about being in the theater and experiencing Endgame for the first time, and I was just like, because I remembered going there myself, and I was just like crazy because there were so many people that had the exact same experience.

SPEAKER_00

What an amazing experience. I remember getting teary-eyed, like those tears of joy that you get where you're just like overwhelmed when you hear Sam Wilson and everyone show up shows up, and you're like, oh man, and then yeah, just everything that led up to that, and then of course, yeah, tears of pure pain when Tony, of course, sacrifices. Um, kind of to lead on uh transition that um you can go see Infinity or not Infinity War, you can see Endgame back in theaters, uh I believe in September this year. Oh they're gonna be putting a re-release.

SPEAKER_01

And they're not gonna do infinity and endgame.

SPEAKER_00

I don't know. I think it's just endgame, but I could be wrong.

SPEAKER_01

Um it'd be cool if they did like a double feature. That'd be crazy.

SPEAKER_00

I think what their plan is for Endgame because it is um because Avengers Doomsday is like a direct follow-up to Endgame because of Cap's involvement and everything like that, and Thor and stuff. Um, because of that, uh they're re-releasing it. And they're also gonna have some deleted scenes uh as well. And possibly some post-credit stuff.

SPEAKER_01

Uh this is making me think of something. So I was at I was at like a retreat this weekend, and one of my friends, he he knows that I know you and I have this podcast and talk about stuff and keep in the know with movies and stuff. He said that he had seen an article about a potential like who Doctor Doom is and why it's RDJ. I don't think we necessarily need to get into it right now unless you want to. Um, but I guess it would I guess it would kind of be like since we haven't even seen the trailer yet, I don't know if they would even you know reveal it in the trailer, but I don't know how this person would know this stuff. But just the fact that Endgame is being used, now I'm like, wait a minute, what's happening? But then that also conflicts with, yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00

I mean we can wait till we get to our doomsday segment.

SPEAKER_01

Uh yeah, I I we'll talk about it more then, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, because I mean we can talk about like trailer description as well as uh um you know what people are saying online because I think um Den and Erds he's actually been spot on on who uh Daredevil is and ha actually has some like confirmations to back it up, as well as other people going off of different uh theories um or the same theory as him uh after the fact. Uh yeah. Kind of cool stuff. But um the first first and foremost, I want to rant uh or not really rant, but kind of uh voice my concern about the Mandalorian and Gorgu. Because I fear and it should it should be uh most people's fear, if uh you know you are a Star Wars fan. Uh how many years has it been now since Star Wars was in theater? About six, six, seven years about.

SPEAKER_01

I swear it's a conspiracy that people say six, seven with everything. You just said six or seven years. I'm just I'm just saying, because you were guessing on how long it's been since something has been in theater.

SPEAKER_00

No, it is kind of weird though. It is kind of weird. Um some reason it's always brought up. So I'm a bus driver and I was pulling my bus in, and the we have our bays where we line up our buses and they're all numbered, and the buses that bus bays that I was pulling into were six and seven. Uh so it was kind of interesting. Sometimes that happens. Sometimes it happens, but um it was seven years ago, though. Okay, so yeah. Seven years ago, um, yeah, 2019. What am I thinking? That's when uh Rise of Skywalker. Rise of Skywalker. Oh man, so it's been that long since we've had nearly a decade. I'll round up. Nearly a decade since we had Star Wars in theaters, and um Mandalorian and Grogu is their answer. Uh now I want to kind of go over viewership and we can talk about like the hype and where the fandom is. Um, because I'll be interested, because I'm obviously pretty plugged in with Star Wars, um, considering like I have to just follow it a lot more closely than uh a lot of people, but I would like to to know your opinions as well. Um so the teaser trailer, which came out six months ago, is on YouTube, this is YouTube alone, has 12 million views. 12 million, and it's been on much not at all. I mean, we were talking about, I mean, just go back to our past episode. We were talking about some of these like viewer uh views. Supergirl had like um 17 million within like a few days. Uh Dune had like 35 million in a few days. Now, this is a teaser, but usually the teasers get a ton of viewership because it's the first look at the movie, and it's at 12 million views, and so after the teaser, usually the viewership is uh either consistent or lower, unless it's an absolutely phenomenal trailer. But the official trailer is only at 11 million views, and that came out two months ago. The final trailer, which released four days ago, which I have a reaction to that trailer on my channel if you want to check it out. Um that is only at 3.9 million views. Okay. Really? So so tell me, bro, based on these numbers alone, what do you think is going on?

SPEAKER_01

Well, so I didn't watch the trailer on the official site. I watched it through your reaction on your channel. Um, so there's minus one view from me. I was actually just looking up one of um the channels that I follow that's big Star Wars fans, and they haven't reacted to it. And how many days ago did it come out again?

SPEAKER_00

Four days. Four days ago.

SPEAKER_01

Four days. So they have uploaded a video one day ago. So and they're like multiple daily uploads kind of channel, so and they've released something today, so it's just surprising that they haven't. They're re-watching Clone Wars.

SPEAKER_00

See, that's kind of that is what makes me concerned. Sure. You know, you look at channels that do breakdowns that do reactions. If you're not seeing breakdowns or reactions to these trailers, and if they don't have high viewership on these reactions or breakdowns, did heavy spoilers? Or I believe I believe he might have, but he's been very s uh stringent on what he uh will react in breakdown because you know he he's just trying to be more uh efficient with his channel. And he's not gonna cover things that don't have viewership.

SPEAKER_01

Right. Interesting. Um I was gonna check one of the big channels as well. Another big channel that does breakdowns. New Rockstars? Yeah. And they don't have one in the world.

SPEAKER_00

This is what I'm saying. This is what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01

They have two Avengers, they have a Euphoria, the Pit, the Boys, another Avengers Doomsday. They have three Avengers Doomsdays in the last three days.

SPEAKER_00

Oh bro, this is what I'm saying. This is why I wanted to talk about it because I'm genuinely concerned. I think season three of Mandalorian did far more damage than we realized. It left the characters in a weird place. Book of Boba Fett, um, even before season three, reunited Mendo and Grogu when they shouldn't have been reunited. You know, we end season two at such a high point. Luke shows up. Grogu goes off with Luke to be trained. Oh my gosh, we're gonna see Luke training Yoda, uh a baby Yoda. What happened to that? What happened to that? No, they decided Grogu's gonna make his own own choice. And listen, I like the idea of Luke being kind of like the mature Jedi, and he's giving Grogu a choice. Uh, and people act like the Jedi of the Clone Wars didn't give people choices. Um, they did. You didn't have to give your kid away to the Jedi. People chose that, but did the kid choose that? Not necessarily because they were like a baby a lot of the times. So, um, but I think it left the characters in such a weird place because now it took away their arc. Their whole arc, you know, Mando's whole arc was to protect Grogu to get him to a Jedi. Gets him to the Jedi, the Jedi. And then they're like, Well, we can't lose our cash cow. Mando and Groga Grogu are most popular characters at this moment.

SPEAKER_01

To me, it's not they were afraid. Yeah, they they they chose the safe route rather than the artistic route.

SPEAKER_00

I know, and you could have explored he could have made his way back to Mando. He could have. Eventually, yeah. In a sense, yeah. Like you could have, but they were they panicked and they didn't know what to do. Um, and now we're at a weird place where you have season three, and they're not even the main characters, as Bo Katan, which isn't like I like Bo Katan as a character. Yeah, she's a great character, she's awesome, but why is she the primary focus? Why is her journey the primary focus? Um, using Mando and Grogu as like kind of a shuttle for her to progress the story of the Mandalorian.

SPEAKER_01

I guess unless they they didn't make this evident when they created the movie, but if it was supposed to be about Mandalorian people, that's one thing, but they had two seasons of Dinjaran being the Mandalorian, yeah. So changing it up in season three to be Bo Katan, if they had made it evident that like each season was gonna follow a new um Mandalorian, it might have worked better.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and and I think in large part that's because Mando had the Darksaber, and then they're like, shoot, now he's got the Darksaber. Do we want to make him the leader? But what about Bo Katan? She's still around. Oh, and we know that you know Mandalore was like annihilated. What about Bo Katan? Did she survive and like her people, like the night owls and everything like that? So then you have to like go into all of that. Um, and of course, you have her in Rebels, so you know that she's around, um, or she was around. Uh, and then you're like, Well, is she still around? And it's like, oh man. And so my issue is like, what what are the characters? And something I talk about in my reaction video, is you know, what's where are we going with Grogu? Is this a sending off point for him? Because it kind of the the tone, which is hard to tell in the trailer, like what type of story they're trying to tell. It it seems like Din's trying to prepare Grogu to be on his own, as if Din's gonna die or something's gonna happen to him. But I don't think they're bold enough to kill him off and have Grogu on his own. Because I think once Grogu talks, and once he's no longer like a baby, you lose a lot of the general audience, like the normies, as we call them, who really like Grogu because he's a cute baby and makes cute baby sounds and stuff like that. So, so what do you think from there? What do you think's gonna go on with these characters? What are their arcs?

SPEAKER_01

So, yeah, uh when you said that I started thinking about it. I was like, well, they're part of it is gonna be continuing to destroy the remnants of the Empire because that's in and in the trailer I remember hearing Din saying that that is what he wants to do. He just wants to take out the bad guys which is not necessarily what he was in season one, which, of course, characters grow, so he's becoming the good guy by being around Grogu and stuff and being around like the light side of the force. But you know, I kinda like a character that, you know, still might have his bounty hunter ways and stuff like that, and instead now he's just I'm the Mandalorian that hunts down the Empire. Yeah. And then it's like, and then I have this, you know, essentially weapon of mass destruction Jedi with me that's learning to also be part Mandalorian. Exactly. So it's interesting. I don't know. I am not like I'm gonna go see it. It's not like I'm like itching to go see it. There's so many other movies that I'm like itching to go see, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_00

That's the problem.

SPEAKER_01

Um and yeah, I and at one point I was super down for it. I even was excited when season three came out, and I was watching, and then I'm pretty sure it was the Jack Black episode. And then I stopped, I stopped watching. I literally didn't finish the season after that episode.

SPEAKER_00

I wanted to like it because I like Jack Black, but you put Jack Black in Star Wars, you're like Wasn't it also Lizzo? Lizzo too, who's Lizzo.

SPEAKER_01

It's like, you know, I yeah, it's just like at least she wasn't problematic at the time, I don't think.

SPEAKER_00

No, no, she wasn't at the time.

SPEAKER_01

Um but it's just like yeah, it's just uh, you know, it lost it. And I was so excited because I was still up to that point, I think I was enjoying the season. And it was just something about that episode I don't know, I just didn't turn it on the next week, and then the next week came after. I'm like, I should really get back to it and finish it, and then I never did, and then um, yeah, it's unfortunate.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and you know, I think a lot of this boils down to you know, Disney Plus really did dilute Star Wars um in a lot of ways, in a lot of ways. Uh The Mandalorian obviously was its flagship uh TV show, you know. It was the show that kind of made Disney Plus uh it was there on release, and that was the show to get people hooked into Disney Plus. Um, along with having the entire catalog of Marvel movies and Star Wars movies and Disney movies and Pixar and whatnot. Um, but I think um I think season four of Mandalorian is was turned into this movie. I think I think they had plans to have a movie come out in 2026 years ago. Kathleen Kennedy Kennedy famously can't seem to get movies off the runway. Um you have the X-Wing Pro X-Wing project that failed. You have uh Donald Glover's um Lando movie that she says is talk to him, she says uh, and everything like that. Uh, but anyways, you have all these movies kind of fall through. You have uh Ray's movie, um, but yeah, anyways, all these movies fall through, and then they're like, shoot, we need to have a movie because she has pressure, or she had pressure, because you know, now we got Dave and uh what's her name. But Star Wars has pressure to release a movie this year, turn season four of Mandalorian and Grogu into a movie. I mean, you watch the trailer, like what's what are what are the big threats? You know, we know the Mando universe, the Huts. The man, I mean, yes, so we have the twins that are introduced in Book of Boba Fett, and we're like, okay. And then we have Rada, the Hut, Jabba's son, who's that gladiator hut. Now, kind of some predictions here. Um, I think uh because Din's talking here Din is talking about how he wants to hunt Imperial Remnants. I think it's gonna show him do that in the beginning, but he's gonna get caught up because he's gonna be chased down by uh Embo. He's gonna get caught up with the huts, and that's gonna be a primary thing uh for him. And so I think that's gonna be the main line of the story. I think the imperial aspect of it will be something he's doing with the new republic for a little bit. Um, but I think uh the main stuff is gonna go down with the huts and embo and everything like that. And maybe we'll get some uh what I was gonna originally say is the Mandalverse has Thrawn as its big threat. You know, we watched Ahsoka Thrawn's Back in the Galaxy now. That's gonna be the main thing. Heir to the Empire as a movie is gonna be uh, you know, that's Dave Filoni's movie. At least it was uh announced alongside those other two movies um at the last Star Wars celebration. Is that before Mando and Grogu were even turned into a movie? Yep, yep. They didn't announce Mando and Grogu until uh until afterwards. Which means it probably is season four. It is season four turned into a movie, and that's the problem because we're gonna go see this movie. We're gonna be like, all right, that was like that was like fun. That's Mando and Grogu, I guess, but like what what was that? You know, what was that?

SPEAKER_01

Well, and um and uh like how many hours is uh a season compared to this? I don't think were they all 30-minute episodes? I don't remember. They're typically an hour. Yeah. So if you and so how long is the show or movie gonna be? Is it gonna be long enough to be a full season?

SPEAKER_00

Well, or is it gonna be typically they cut down a lot of like if it is like converted like this, or like um, you know, they do like a special presentation or something. But what's concerning is you know, TV shows to movies typically, you know, aren't really successes um in terms of box office, in terms of viewership, uh things like this. Uh, and if we look just basing our information off the trailers, it's it doesn't look good. It doesn't look good. My box office prediction, I think this thing maybe at most makes seven 700 is generous, I think. I think 500 is probably around where it's gonna land. I I genuinely don't think that there's like no buzz for this movie. I don't know anyone that's like, I'm so excited to go see this movie.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. It's just I think I think when I showed Caitlin, she was excited because of just baby Yoda, and that's about it. Yeah. Um but yeah, anyways, yeah, that's unfortunate. Star Wars is really cool. There's so many cool stories. Yeah. And they somehow just can't seem to get it to work. Except if you wanted to talk about what you have been enjoying, Star Wars. Yes.

SPEAKER_00

Um, any final things you wanted to say about I mean, I mean, I was gonna touch a little bit on like, is there a plan? Um, but that kind of ties into to what I'm gonna talk about. Maul Shadow Lord, if you guys haven't seen it. I won't get into spoilers here. Um I am uh currently watching through that. I think I'm on episode six, or I think I just finished episode six, which is the latest uh episode five and six came out. Um they've been doing like two episodes of release uh or a week. And uh I think it's it is phenomenal. I mean, if you look at the ratings, solid ratings, so good. I think for a while it's been sitting at like a hundred percent on Rotten Tomatoes. I don't know if that's changed at all. I can't imagine it has. But the animation, the acting, the writing, the the the study of like the force and uh you know how the Empire is uh this looming presence, the Inquisitors, Maul and his shadow collective, it's all so good. Uh and I think Maul Shadow Lord is the first look at what Dave Fallone has planned for Star Wars. Now, is there a through line plan? I don't know. I don't know if he has a through line plan, but if we're getting products on the quality of Maul Shadow Lord with Sam Whitware, you know, his influence as well, because he's a lore master when it comes to Star Wars as well. He deeply understands Star Wars. Um, I mean, I mean, you've seen a few episodes, you haven't watched all of it, I know. Yeah, yeah. Or uh, you're not caught up, but you have seen a few episodes. What do you think?

SPEAKER_01

I uh yeah, I enjoyed them. Um I will have to be honest, I think I was a little bit less like full focus. I think it was more of a second monitor thing that I was doing, which, you know, isn't always great because sometimes like there are things I can do second monitor perfectly fine, and then there's others where I'm like, I should be paying more attention if I want to really know everything. I think there was cool scenes in it that I saw. Um, I mean, Maul's a fan favorite character, I really like him. Um when you brought up the stuff about how it could potentially connect to Mandalorian, that was exciting. Um related to a particular person that's a part of the Mandalorian cult. Um I won't say anything else beside that, but um, I don't know if anything else has been revealed on that. But yeah, I I'm curious. Um, do you think Star Wars is just better now with the people in charge better now as an animated? Um but we still have Andor, but at the same time, Andor could also be.

SPEAKER_00

I think Andor is a one and done at this point.

SPEAKER_01

I yeah, no, I get that, but I was like, but is Andor more of like a sci-fi more than a Star Wars? Which we've had this conversation in the past, where i is it more sci-fi and like just take out the Star Wars aspect and it's still a good show, but obviously it elevates it a bit um like uh uh audience-wise when you add Star Wars to it, um just because Star Wars is such a household name.

SPEAKER_00

But yeah. So I think um I I get what you're saying. I think generally I would say that Star Wars fits better as an animation as far as TV shows go. I think when it comes to movies, um, live actions where it thrives. Now you have the argument of Andor. Andor is a very well uh crafted show, it's fantastic, it's fantastic. Um, you know, we've had our discussions about it, but I also think Andor was one and done, and I also think that Andor shied away from the weirder elements of Star Wars, barely any aliens in it, almost no references to the force. I think there was some like hinting at it in this final season two, but other than that, it hasn't really touched on the force, which is a major theme of Star Wars. Um and I think that uh I think I'm I'm blanking on his name, the creator um of it. Oh god, what's his name? He did the the Bourne movies, right? He did all that stuff. Um yeah, I'm blanking on his name, but let me know in the comments, guys. I I can't remember. Anyways, he wasn't necessarily a Star Wars fan to begin with. He obviously was able to create a good show in the universe itself, but is it a Star Wars show? Doug Lehman. No. Tony Gilroy. Tony Gilroy, there it is.

SPEAKER_01

Sorry, it's going down the list of people on Born Identity.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, uh Tony Gilroy, Tony Gilroy. Um, anyways, like, yeah, he's he's a great creator. Um he did really good with Andor. But yeah, I mean, I don't know if I would consider Andor a Star Wars show to begin with. A lot of people are like, what? It's like rebellion versus empire. Like, how is it not? But like you lose a lot of the Star Wars mythical aspects. Star Wars was created not to go on a whole tangent, you know, we'll wrap this up here and move on to our next segment. Um, but I would say that Star Wars, George Lucas created Star Wars as modern fantasy as modern fairy tale. And it is it strays away from that when you have Andor, which has a lot of real-world elements, which has a lot of like darkness to it with um, you know, uh sexual assault and stuff like that, that um, you know, or attempted essay that happens in Andor season two, like things like that, um, that kind of takes you out of the Star Wars fantasy. Could you imagine the Empire doing evil stuff? Yeah, but they're like kind of like they're the evil bad guys. We know they're bad.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, they're more comp like like their cartoon bad guys rather than yeah.

SPEAKER_00

We're gonna build a Death Star that to blow up planets.

SPEAKER_01

Um surprisingly make a fatal flaw and have a little hole vent ready for it to be displayed.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Which that's also not how lasers work, but still, it's cool.

SPEAKER_00

But it but it's kyber crystals lasers, so they're super cool and special.

SPEAKER_01

So they can bend like the wanted movies, they can curve the bullets. Oh gosh. You remember that? Yeah, crazy.

SPEAKER_00

I remember the amount of people that believed that was true, too. No, no, you can't.

SPEAKER_01

Mythbusters did something to prove that. Anyways, yeah, getting off.

SPEAKER_00

But, anyways, yeah, I don't know. My box office prediction is low. I don't think it's gonna make that much.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I think I mean Star Wars is probably top five movie brands of all time, right?

SPEAKER_00

I think it would be top ten IPs of all time. Okay. Top five movies?

SPEAKER_01

I mean what I mean is like recognizable, every like general audience all knows what it is.

SPEAKER_00

I think it's worldwide, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

People know worldwide, it's like top five. I'm not saying like like if not top three money or anything like that. I just mean like if you put Star Wars on something, nine times out of ten, someone's gonna know what Star Wars is.

SPEAKER_00

Well, and also if you look at Lego as a brand, I can imagine their best-selling stuff has got to be Star Wars.

SPEAKER_01

Right, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00

Could I be wrong? Yeah, I could be wrong.

SPEAKER_01

Sure, but I genuinely video games still do pretty good.

SPEAKER_00

Their video games are the best, dude. And I I I honestly think with the amount of products that they have for Star Wars alone, it's gotta be their best-selling uh brand deal.

SPEAKER_01

Really? Is the game aspect of it?

SPEAKER_00

Well, no, no, the the Lego sets.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, the Lego sets, yeah, yeah. Yeah, well, toys and Star Wars go hand in hand. That was George Lucas' kind of idea. It was just let's make toys.

SPEAKER_00

Well, yeah, he said he keeps 100% of the merchandising. That was his whole plan.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, so he still has the merchandising?

SPEAKER_00

I don't I think he sold that to Disney as well. Oh, that was when he when he originally made Star Wars, that's what he kept. Uh and then like uh yeah, but that's how he made all his money with merchandising. Right. Um, but anyways.

SPEAKER_01

But yeah, so that's our Star Wars segment. But hey, that's part of this channel. We started with Star Wars and Marvel, and then um we've added to it. Um it's a big part of both of our lives. Obviously, you have made a whole YouTube channel around it. I enjoy it on the side. Um I still play, you know, part of my rotation of games, Star Wars The Old Republic, is in there. Yeah. I love it. And um, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I'll continue to love it. And you know what? Maybe it'll be the case that I mean you look at how low our hype level is for it. Maybe everyone else is low too, and they're gonna go see it regardless. Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So I think it could still pull 300 million though.

SPEAKER_00

Three just three hundred million?

SPEAKER_01

Oh, yeah. I know that's how it is, but in today's market.

SPEAKER_00

Oh yeah. Maybe 500. I mean, you might just say Star Wars is dead at that point, right?

SPEAKER_01

Uh maybe. I don't know. I don't know. Andor season one was one of the lowest viewed things in all history, and then they came back with season two and just blew everything out of the water.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So but uh you know who would uh blow stuff out of the water? Thrag. Tell us. Ooh. Invincible.

SPEAKER_01

That was a good episode. Um obviously, if you guys haven't watched it, I highly recommend you go watch uh Invincible if you're into animation. I mean, if you're listening this far into the podcast, you probably are. Um but if you haven't watched it, it's a pretty fun show about superheroes and um uh and what if Krypton was evil? Um essentially, yeah. Also Super Saiyans. Also, like Super Should be Also Super Saiyans, yep, yep. There even was a direct nod to them in this episode. You'll have to remind me. Uh the fire going into the uh with the three of them. It went from red or went from orange to blue.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, sick, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Like it powered up, so yeah. Um yeah, one thing I'll say about it, and this is gonna be my one negative mark, but uh the fact that the animation is still struggling, like they must spend so much money on the voice acting, because the voice acting is it has to be my favorite part. When they're just talking, it's just the best part of the whole show. The animation, it comes and goes, it has incredible moments. I'm wondering if they're spreading themselves too thin doing all of the critical role shows, because it's the same studio that's doing all of them.

SPEAKER_00

And then I watch Critical Role. Or uh sorry, yeah, Vox Machina.

SPEAKER_01

I watch Vox and Machna, and I'm like Isn't that animation incredible?

SPEAKER_00

Insane, and I'm like, they are the same guys, aren't they?

SPEAKER_01

Same guys, and then even Mighty Nine even takes it up, but every season has been consistent with those. Um, and again, I the only thing I can think is the the A-list actors that they pulled from live action to do voices in Invincible is what did it. I mean, but they're still doing that in Vox Machina, but they also have some of like the you don't necessarily like there are so many voice actors out there that are good voice actors that do not need to be A-list actors. Of course, it helps, it brings like a name to the brand, like having J.K. Simmons as Omniman is huge. Steven Ewan is uh as invincible. Also, the fact that I didn't even realize that Stephen Ewan is uh Zuko in the new um Avatar. Oh, really? I didn't like it. Yeah, he he's adult Zuko. Um, and um yeah, I unfortunately got spoiled on um TikTok one clip of it, and I just listened to it and then I moved on. Um but that's when I heard, and I was like, wait, that is not the original Zuko voice actors. Then I looked it up with Stephen Ewan. Which is all of them are new, all of them are new actors, by the way.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_01

Okay, they're none of the same ones from the original show. Which which isn't bad.

SPEAKER_00

I mean, they grow up. You grow up, you're not gonna sound the same.

SPEAKER_01

Sorry, I I'm getting sidetracked, I'm getting sidetracked.

SPEAKER_00

No, it's funny that you bring up Avatar because I wanted to talk about Avatar in comparison to Invincible.

SPEAKER_01

Invincible, okay.

SPEAKER_00

Animation alone. Uh yeah. Animation alone. I've seen some of these clips, and I'm also on the fence. I might watch the movie solely because the artists are on contract and have already been paid. The only people that would be losing money is Paramount. And I don't Paramount, come on, I don't care. I don't care about Paramount. Um, don't say that, bro.

SPEAKER_01

We won't get a sponsorship now from that. Oh, Paramount Plus. Uh hold on. No, what they might own Warner Brothers and DC.

SPEAKER_00

What they did to Halo, bro, I cannot forgive them. Halo was a travesty. But what I will say is um that the fight scenes that I've seen, my goodness, what is going on with Invincible? Even this last episode, which people are hyping up and they're praising, and I love it. I love it. Like you said, you're talking about the voice acting. It's so good, it's so good, and it kind of makes me think of uh reading a comic book where they're like still images, but even those images are like phenomenal, but there's still images and even then, yeah, you're reading it, and so I mean, I can kind of look past some of the animation because I'm I'm so locked in on the characters and their story, but some of the animation does pull me out of it, and I'm just like it just looks like a PNG being dragged across the screen, right? Uh and and you see some stuff where like Thrag goes to punch Nolan and the air is being like sucked in as he's like going to punch him, and it looks dope and like the impact frames and like things like that, and I'm like, oh, there's such cool stuff, but then just like the general, like it's just like it's so hit or miss, and it's inconsistent to the point where I'm just like it takes me out of the moment, uh you know what I mean? Right, right.

SPEAKER_01

I agree, and and it is just unfortunate. That's the like the one area uh it it is a hit or miss. Season one, phenomenal the whole way through. Season two started to show uh colors in the beginning, and then it went crazy. Like the Conquest Fight episode was one of the best animated episodes that they've ever done. And then season three it started happening again, and then they have this episode which was season three was conquest.

SPEAKER_00

Season two was um, what's his name? Big Head. Um yeah, Angstrom Levy. Yeah, season two was kind of where people were like, what is this, dude? Mm-hmm. Uh but season three, because of Conquest, that was the hype, dude. That fight. Oh yeah, Invincible, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Anyway, this next episode also might be crazy because I I saw the sneak peek for it and it looks crazy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

So, and of course, you know.

SPEAKER_01

But um, I'm glad that our boy Lee Pace got redeemed from online hate. Uh, and I love seeing all the comments now of everybody saying, I never said you were a fraud, Thrag. Yeah. Because there were so many people saying that he seems like a wimp in the other episodes that he's been in. And then in this episode it showed how good he is and how he it was just like so uh so stupid for him to ever get into any conflicts because it would just win every single one. So he's kind of one of those guys that just lets things play out for the fun of it because he knows how strong he is.

SPEAKER_00

He knows he's the strongest.

SPEAKER_01

I mean and he could win the war himself.

SPEAKER_00

And it's interesting because you know excuse me. Um with uh Thrag, like he's stronger than he was in the comics as well. Um at least the same strength.

SPEAKER_01

That's what I've heard from well I've heard he's strong.

SPEAKER_00

I've heard he was stomping people. Even like he's he's to Viltramites what human or Viltramites are to humans or something. That's crazy. Uh but I I think super cool that they made him so strong, and like Mark was genuinely terrified. And you see Mark wondering why Omni Man's so scared the whole time. And then for Mark to finally realize why Thrag is so terrifying, um, it's it's crazy. It's absolutely crazy. But yeah, you know, he he isn't afraid of anyone or anything. Uh he should be afraid of Space Racer's gun, but apparently Space Racer doesn't want to shoot at Thrag at all. So there's one time the beam goes past him, but other than that, it's like, come on. Um I can imagine I don't know.

SPEAKER_01

Gotta kill the red shirts first.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you do. And obviously, you can't just story-wise, there would be no story if Space Eraser just shoots Thrag. Like, what what okay? Cool, story's over. It's just fun to like joke about that and be like, Space Racer, what are you doing? What are you doing? Just stand in the backfield and snipe this guy, dude.

SPEAKER_01

Right, right.

SPEAKER_00

Oh man, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_01

Um yeah, but no, it was super cool. I just don't want to give anything away if anybody hasn't really watched it, but yeah. Uh, it was a big payoff for the character of Thrag. And people were even comparing the way that he was acting as a voice character to a character in Dragon Ball Z, actually.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_01

Um, they were saying the way that he said one of his lines sounded exactly like this character from Dragon Ball Z. Um, I can't remember the name of that character. I have to be honest, Dragon Ball Z, uh, it was where he says no and he's splitting apart the giant rocks in space.

unknown

No.

SPEAKER_00

I choose death.

SPEAKER_01

That no specifically was like so.

SPEAKER_00

Is it Vegeta or something?

SPEAKER_01

No, it was someone with like a J name. I don't know. Gohan? I don't have to look at it. Goku. I don't think it was Gyro.

SPEAKER_00

I just started watching uh Dragon Ball Z Kai on uh. So I'm I'm trying to get into it. Yeah, it's pretty cool. So Dragon Ball Dragon Ball Z Kai is like they take away a lot of the filler episodes. And so it's like really it's like condensed. Um and then I'll get into the movies and stuff from there. I started with Dragon Ball, and I was just like, this is too goofy. This like it was it was too kind of much of a hard watch. So I was like, let me get into Dragon Ball Z. Everyone says that's where like the hype is.

SPEAKER_01

So um, but yeah, the I I think super good episode. I highly recommend everybody catch up on it if they enjoy superheroes and they like animation. It it's still fun, even with our gripes about it. I think the story is strong enough on its own to keep you watching it. Although you can hope for more, it's still decent.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I still think the story alone is is um I mean we it's what keeps me coming back, these characters, you know.

SPEAKER_01

Like a 10 out of 10 story, and then it's like a six out of ten animation.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, the animation's just like man, if they could do the level of Vox Machina, Avatar. Oh man. Oh man. Why they don't, I don't know. I think there's like a level of like they rush to get it out, and it has to be because of the voice actors.

SPEAKER_01

I think there's just so much money in voice actors. Because each season they keep bringing in more and more and more. But even Vox Machina has some some cool voice actor cameos. Oh yeah, I guess. I guess not as big. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um, but anyways, uh that's that's invincible. It'll be fun to watch it with uh friend of the channel Locke. Locke, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

When he finally catches up, um he's waiting to binge them all. We could watch it from then, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I wanted to spoil him over the weekend, and then he's like, No, I want to talk about it, but like yeah, for his sake, for his sake, yeah, I won't do that to him.

SPEAKER_01

And same for the sake of all of you, so you have a chance to watch it. Just know that Thrag is coming and you have four seasons to get to him if you haven't watched, but if not, catch up on this season.

SPEAKER_00

And I don't think we gave anything away that was like super spoily other than you should be scared of Thrag. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Um, and um should we get into the main meat of this?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I think, you know, um our channel was built upon the bones of Thanos.

SPEAKER_01

And I think uh did we start it right after Endgame?

SPEAKER_00

I actually can't I think so.

SPEAKER_01

I think so actually it was 2021, I'm pretty sure that we started. Okay. So it was two years after Endgame. Yeah, and I think But it was after the break, and it was like when things were kind of starting up again.

SPEAKER_00

You know what's funny is so many channels started in Infinity War and like blew up because of those those movies in that universe. It's just funny like thinking about like what our podcast. Yeah, if we started then versus after.

SPEAKER_01

Like where we know, I'm glad when we started. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And I'm and honestly, we can play you know the what if game all day long, but we never know. You never know. Uh let's not play it like Disney played the what if show, though. Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01

Sorry.

SPEAKER_00

Let's not just do a serialized or whatever whatever what do you call it, anthology series of episodes, you know, looking at cool universes. Let's try and connect it to like one big story and let's focus on only these characters. Oh my goodness. What are they doing? And then Marvel Zombies, like there were some cool fight scenes in Marvel Zombies, but even Marvel Zombies, I was like, Alright. What if Disney just tried? What if Disney just tried? Uh it seems like they're trying with Doomsday. CinemaCon got an absolutely insane trailer.

SPEAKER_01

The trailer down in Junior. I don't did you listen to any of that speech? Because some of that is online.

SPEAKER_00

Uh, I watched uh some breakdowns of the description. Uh-huh. Uh, it looks pretty it sounds pretty awesome.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

New Rockstars has a really good uh video on it. Because not only do they address like what's said or what is seen, but kind of like the context of it um amongst the crowd and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_01

Um his trailer, it was a good breakdown.

SPEAKER_00

I think uh New Rockstars might have done a better one, in my opinion. Um just because of the the way they described the context of uh each scene.

SPEAKER_01

But I think my favorite Sean Campia, he did a pretty good one as well. I know you don't like John Campia, but I like him.

SPEAKER_00

He's alright. I think he's I think he might be a little out of touch sometimes, but that's okay.

SPEAKER_01

The reason I like I like his stuff is because he is directly related to like the movie theater business. That's been his whole thing. And that's where I think you can get a lot of like the fandom stuff. Sure. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. And and he has a lot of subjective takes, but you know, that is what art is, it's subjective. And he talks about that all the time. He's like, what I like is not gonna always be what everybody else likes, and what you like is not gonna be what everybody else likes. And so when I when I hear that, I I like that. But he talked about the trailer and he said it was super cool, um, breaking it down. Um, and uh yeah, so do you want to get into a little bit of that?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah. Um I don't know if we'll go into a full breakdown of it unless you want to.

SPEAKER_01

I just want to break down just a little bit of it. I wanted to talk about uh one of the things that I heard uh was that Robert Downey Jr.'s character of Doom has an Eastern European accent. Yeah. I have heard that. So um and it's um, you know, and then there's a bunch of X-Men stuff and the colliding of potentially universes because of incursions, and yeah. Um uh I think there was a scene of Captain America picking up Mujnir again. Yep.

SPEAKER_00

Um, and uh there was there's some fight scenes between some cool characters like Shang-Chi and uh Gambit. Oh, yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_01

I heard that. Yeah, yeah. You know, um yeah, I heard something.

SPEAKER_00

Which they said looks really cool because of the.

SPEAKER_01

If you put on my bingo card that Shang-Chi and Gambit were gonna fight this scene, I would not have had it on there.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Um, essentially, I think what this trailer is setting up is kind of like Avengers versus X-Men in a lot of ways. Yeah, um, because that's gonna be a big part of this movie is gonna be Doom kind of tricking the Avengers and X-Men into fighting each other.

SPEAKER_01

Um, and then you think that'll turn into Reed coming and telling them that they need to team up?

SPEAKER_00

I think Reed's already involved. I think the Fantastic Four is already involved with Doom. So we see in the post-credit scene of Fantastic Four, Doom with Franklin, um, Doom's there to see Reed and to team up with Reed about incursions. They go to mainline MCU and meet up with the Avengers. They're like, hey, we need to go stop these X-Men. They keep destroying all these Earths, like they're gonna collide with us, and they're gonna like, I don't know. Interesting. These X-Men are supposedly from from what everybody is saying behind the scenes, these X-Men that we're gonna see are not necessarily good guys, but they're not bad. They're just saving their earth and destroying the other ones. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01

Oh, the X-Men are actually destroying other Earths to protect their own?

SPEAKER_00

To protect their own because of incursions, because they keep getting these incursions because of the multiverse uh collapse and everything like that.

SPEAKER_01

Um Yeah. Did we hear is this from um is this the universe where Logan died and they lost their Wolverine?

SPEAKER_00

Supposedly this is the universe after Days of Future Past. Where Logan comes back and he's like he's like, can someone explain the last like 50 years or something to me? And Charles is like, Oh, I see you're back, or whatever. And he realizes that Wolverine is a very good thing. Oh, because they're by the band. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Because he saved you know the doomed universe uh and everything like that. Which awesome X-Men movie. I like Days of Future. It is, yeah. Yeah, really cool time travel stuff. Um the sentinels in that movie are so scary. Oh my goodness. The way they take out the X-Men, they just murder them, they just ruthless oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01

So uh actually, so this actually makes me want to bring up what I brought up in the beginning of our podcast, which is what my friend said he read an article. Okay, and this is I don't think that this is true, and I don't know where he heard this from. Okay, but when you said that they're gonna be re-releasing Endgame because it's like a direct continuation into Doom, uh Doomsday, it got me curious. Yeah. So it's not because of Robert Downey Jr. But um in this apparent article that this guy read, he read that this uh Doctor Doom is Tony Stark variant that somehow survived snapping his fingers uh after endgame.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, so he's a Tony Stark?

SPEAKER_01

He's not That's what this article said. So again, yeah, this is all right. That doesn't make any sense. Well, so yeah, yeah, but I mean it's honestly it it's interesting because they're doing the endgame thing, because that was all about Tony Stark's sacrifice, but what if he snapped his fingers and all the Avengers died and he was the only one left? But it doesn't explain his Eastern European accent. So in my mind, I'm like, how does that work? Uh but then someone said they're like, well, what if Tony Stark was just born in um in Doctor Doomsland in this universe?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And I was like, well, I guess that could be, but I think what the the prevailing theory out there is that he's his own person, but he shares the same face as Tony. And whether that's gonna be something he uses as a uh a ploy to trick the Avengers into trusting him is up for debate. Um I think there is a level of skepticism because why do you cast Tony or R RDJ as Victor Von Doom when he's already been Iron Man? You know, for one thing, you could be like, we'll already trust him as an actor with his amazing performance, but there's gotta be something deeper, and there's gotta be something that brings RDJ back because he's not just gonna come back to play Victor Von Doom, he's gonna come back for the story of it, and so whatever story it is, it's gotta be worth it. The Captain America tie-in is uh involving Loki. So apparently, something that we are gonna see is Captain America going back in time, he returns all the stones, he stays with Peggy after returning the stone to that universe. He stays with Peggy um and decides to have a life there with her. Loki shows up and is like, hey, like, um, you know, I can't necessarily have you in this timeline because it's gonna cause problems, but I can move you to a timeline where it won't be a problem. And so they move to a different timeline. They have their life and their family and everything like that. Um, and then eventually, like Cap gets pulled back in somehow, and that's where we see in the trailer him showing up with the hammer. Uh how does that explain old cap though? Old cap? Because that's still in the main universe. Supposedly. Oh. That's what the writers said. Interesting. I think uh the Russo brothers said something otherwise. Okay. Because that's the writers the writers said, oh, it's Cap from he just stayed back in time in that universe. But Russo said that he's that's from a different timeline. Um Okay.

SPEAKER_01

And there's one more thing I got um that is interesting, and you'll probably be able to confirm. I'm I'm pretty sure it's just AI. There's just so much AI out there, it's tough to tell what's real or what's not. But there was a clip of Doctor Doom actually showing up where the Council of Kangs were in that like stadium.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. I've heard of this AI video. I have a lot of people.

SPEAKER_01

It is for sure AI.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it is.

SPEAKER_01

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_00

But they were Denonerds, I think even Denonerds, he thought it was sick.

SPEAKER_01

Um it was the most realistic looking of all the AI. I've got to be a little bit of a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00

Because he said it even has like structure and like everything to it, like look so real.

SPEAKER_01

Um, and and I guess they obviously had the whole uh at the end of the Ant-Man Quantumanium one, they had that huge scene of all the kings in that room. Yeah, the all the kings, the council, and which technically Disney doesn't necessarily have to part ways with Jonathan Majors anymore. They could theoretically bring him back to pass off.

SPEAKER_00

I think there's just still bad publicity attached to him, regardless of that.

SPEAKER_01

Even though he was found, yeah, even though he was found innocent. Yeah. Um, but anyways, uh it it that one was the most, because there was another AI one that I saw where it was Captain America uh and uh Thor fighting Doctor Doom, and Doctor Doom had like a sword and shield, like a magic sword and a shield. And but then you could tell it was AI because Thor's uh stormbreaker was a double edged axe instead of a single edge. And so I was like, okay, well, that obviously is AI, but it was a very cool scene as well. It's like, man, this is AI is getting way too good.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's getting way too good. But also, wouldn't it be funny if people just said it was AI, but it's when one of them is real? Oh it's leaked footage. Um thing I was gonna say is uh in Secret Wars, the Jonathan Hickman secret secret wars, the Thor's become like a police force that God Emperor Doom uses. And a lot of people see that uh think that you know Thor is gonna be like leading the fight against Doom, but he's eventually gonna get controlled by Doom in some manner, um, and that's gonna really mess things up. But they also suspect this is kind of I'm throwing a lot of stuff out there that I've heard um from uh different channels and stuff, but uh they think supposedly Doom's gonna be or Doctor Strange is gonna be involved in helping Doom create Battle World and betraying the Avengers, X-Men, basically the universe, so that Doom can restart it. Because Doom's gonna do a sacrifice play, he's gonna use these people as pawns in the end, like he's gonna do whatever he has to do to win, and whether that's sacrificing people, like he doesn't care, he's gonna do it, he's Doom. Right, right, yeah. But um, Doctor Strange supposedly is gonna work with Doctor Doom to do this, and so supposedly, I keep saying supposedly, uh, Doctor Strange is going to have like the only memory of what happened beforehand, uh, which will be interesting.

SPEAKER_01

Interesting thing. So that also is making me go back to this particular article thing that my buddy brought up this weekend. They were talking he was talking about in the article, it all spawned from the scene where Doctor Strange goes through the 14 million possibilities and he finds the one way it works, and something where it diverged there with Doctor Strange. Interesting. And in one of his observations, and it led to Doctor Doom. Yeah. I don't know, honestly. Um, I think it's tough. I'm so uh what I love is that we don't know, and we can actually have this conversation right now. Yeah, because there's too many times nowadays where we just know everything. Yeah, that's true. Like, even with even with Spider-Man Brand New Day or any of the other stuff that we've talked about, we can kind of guess way better than we can with Doomsday.

SPEAKER_00

It's so up in the air with Doomsdays, so and Doomsday is so tight-lipped as well. The fact that there's no leaked trailer out there, that's insane. There's like trailers.

SPEAKER_01

That that was one thing I heard from John Campia and them when they were talking about it. They said they had people in the rafters with like a certain like uh laser thing that would point out all the cameras that were recording, and they literally saw security guards come up and grab people and take them out. Yeah, that's um so they probably had like uh they literally had like lasers pointing on everyone.

SPEAKER_00

You know, it's so funny that you say that.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um so I have a baby monitor, obviously. Um you can see the IR light that our phones use when that scans our face, it flashes and it's bright. And you can see it even in uh the our we have a car monitor too to watch him in the back seat. And we'll be in the front seat and we'll open our phone. And it's like it looks like a flashlight is flashing your face.

SPEAKER_01

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_00

So if these people are just like whipping their phones out, your camera, if you don't turn that setting off, or if you don't like have that covered, like it's immediately gonna flash you, and that just identifies that your phone's out, and uh you're gonna be caught everyone. There was they caught everyone. Yeah, I think there was one instance I think where they said that a trailer was leaked and it was down within like seconds. It was down within seconds. Wow.

SPEAKER_01

Um, even then, I haven't heard because usually if something actually truly was leaked, it's it's forever on the internet in some capacity. Yeah, someone downloads it because you download it instantly. Yeah. Like there are people that are ready to go on a like a snap.

SPEAKER_00

So um, it's good to screenshot stuff people say as well, because a lot of times people people will go back and delete stuff. Um, especially like celebrities uh doing interviews and stuff. Um they might slip up and say something they're not supposed to. Yeah. About uh, you know, any leaks around the the movies.

SPEAKER_01

So um man, I yeah, I'm so excited for Doomsday. It's gonna be great. Great. And do you think uh was it officially announced that they are moving it one week before Dune now? I don't know. Because there was some conversation that they were gonna rem move it one week before so that they can get the IMAX for that that week before.

SPEAKER_00

Interesting. No, um that does I wouldn't be surprised.

SPEAKER_01

For the Doomsday kind of thing. Or the Doomsday. Doomsday, yeah. Doom Doomsday, yeah. But um either way, I'm still excited for that. Uh it's gonna be a fun Christmas.

SPEAKER_00

Doomsday month. Um, that'll be that'll be a cool Christmas. That really will. Um man, that'll be a lot of fun. I'll be in the theater pretty much every day. Um, I think there's a lot of hype around Doomsday. I think sometimes we get in the mindset, you know, to circle back to what we were talking about with Star Wars. I think Star Wars doesn't have the buzz that Marvel still has. I think some of that comes from uh Marvel Rivals, it's a very big game. Um, a lot of people are still really into superheroes. Uh, you know, you got the boys, you got invincible, yeah. Yeah, I think people are still very much into that, and Star Wars isn't doing anything new or fun with superheroes, or uh not superheroes, but with its own uh fantasy.

SPEAKER_01

So that reminds me, I was talking with another one of my buddies this weekend, and when we were talking about Marvel, he ended up swapping over to talking about Star Wars. Nice, and he said he said that he thinks that they should do something where they make a Star Wars sh movie in the vein of the Dunes like stuff. Like uh I I to like uh essentially because of how good like Dune part one and two is, like, like just start just start making things again with Star Wars and do something like Dune.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_01

I think that's but adding but of course, but add force and stuff. Yeah. I mean, to be fair, I still not to be a contrarian.

SPEAKER_00

I don't want to be contrarian.

SPEAKER_01

No, no, I know, I but I still feel like George Lucas did take from Dune in a lot of ways. Oh yeah, totally. And so they can take it with without being egregious about it. Like, get someone legendary like Denis Vilnew. Get someone legendary like that that can like breathe some life into it.

SPEAKER_00

But then again, I I genuinely believe that's not what Star Wars is. It's not like it's not like Dune, and it's not like Andor, it's not these like very sophisticated storytelling. Okay. Now, aesthetically, like obviously Dune looks really good. Could you do something aesthetically that was Star Wars while still having that mystical fairy tale aspect? Yeah, sure, but I think Star Wars is modern uh mythology, like it is, like it's our modern, it's Star Wars is like like Luke Skywalker, his story with Anakin and like that family is like very much in the vein of like the the Greek gods and like all those like uh Greek myths and stuff like that, uh, with family and ties and like everything in that way. And obviously Dune is uh is its own mythology, but I don't think it is a fairy tale mythology. Um quite like Star Wars.

SPEAKER_01

Like a political drama. That's not necessarily what I'm saying. But like keep keep the story. Dave Fallone, he has George Lucas like in his head, and on speed dial, probably. You have people like you know, uh I I don't know how influential he is in the actual writer's room, but Sam Whitware and people like that, there are people like that with this encyclopedic knowledge of Star Wars. Get someone like Denis Vilneux to direct, not him specifically, because I think he would actually not necessarily work because he thinks I think he needs to have more control than than just directing. But if you can get someone like that, but have those guys, the guys that know the story, do the story. I just don't think that Dave Filoni has it in him to make a good movie. Well, I don't think that he has the skills.

SPEAKER_00

You know what's tough is yeah, he doesn't have the experience.

SPEAKER_01

He has the ideas, he doesn't have the experience. That's true. But like as a writer and a producer, and let someone else like take the helm. Get someone like Greg Fraser on behind the camera.

SPEAKER_00

Sure, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

We need something like that, like we don't even have that.

SPEAKER_00

It has to be visually stunning and exciting to watch. Star Wars is uh along with being like modern mythology, it pushes the bounds of visual entertainment. You know, it pushes the bounds of like it changed cinema, how movies are done, like it changed movies how they're filmed, yeah, it changed movies how they're edited, how sound was incorporated, music, everything. It was that groundbreaking.

SPEAKER_01

And I think Dune is doing that now.

SPEAKER_00

To some degree, I would say.

SPEAKER_01

I I don't think I've seen a movie that has been like as incredible as Dune Part 2 was. I mean, even part one, but like the way that they were able to just take scale and sound and everything to its peak.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

It's just like man.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's a it's great. It's a great experience.

SPEAKER_01

It showed that movies can still be that big.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I think, you know, we we talked about Project Hail Mary enough. I think that showed that, you know, for a lot of people, that movies can still be an experience to be reckoned with. Like you can still have amazing experiences at the movies. Yeah. I think movie theaters just gotta step it up, you know, they just gotta step it up. Um I think something I I heard someone bring up is that quality control within theaters is inconsistent across the board. So you can go to some theaters and it's like a phenomenal theater, it's clean, it looks good, it sounds good, um, you know, everything is well maintained. You can go to others and you're like, this is junk, dude, this is garbage, you know. Um I think I think that's true in a lot of ways. Um, and something that Disney wants to do is Infinity Vision to bring like the best experience that they can with their movies uh and present them to people in theater. So Infinity Vision, is it to replace IMAX? I don't really know. Um I think what they want to do with Infinity Vision uh is pretty cool, but um you could argue that it's just because they don't have IMAX for Doomsday and uh they want to roll out something other. Well, I don't know. And I'm yawning now. My goodness.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, okay, to to to rival IMAX and Dolby cinemas.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Which I I will say, Dolby's are fun, like I they're just loud. I don't know. Yeah, I've never had a Dolby experience where I was like, wow, that was comparable to IMAX. No. Nope.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, I heard that they're adding a um I'm going down to Arizona in a couple of weeks, and I heard that they're adding some sort of like 40 experience at their home. Oh, 40x or something. Yeah, 40x at the Harkins. And I gotta experience that when I'm down there.

SPEAKER_00

You should try it. Uh I've been I've been nervous to try 40x. It sounds like uh it sounds insane.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I think I think it'd be fun to try it. Uh Project Hail Mary like that. Holy Oh, geez, can you imagine the fishing scene? The scene you're just they start spinning in a circle.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, the G forces, the whole room just starts rotating.

SPEAKER_01

Pass out.

SPEAKER_00

Wake up and the movie's done. Wake up and you're in the hospital.

SPEAKER_01

Oh man. Yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00

I I uh I have hope for Dave Fallone. If what he's putting out is comparable to Maul Shadow Lord, uh I think Star Wars will be alright.

SPEAKER_01

Will it be doing Mando and Grogu?

SPEAKER_00

So that's John Favreau, but I hear John Favreau's done after this.

SPEAKER_01

Um that makes sense. He's he's been drugged through it a little bit too much.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and he's also just I feel like he's been mistreated a little. Um, a lot of behind the scenes rumor and stuff like that. Even with Pedro, um some disagreements between them. Oh man. Uh yeah, it's just kind of a bummer. Because I think John really brought something special to Star Wars with Mandalorian. I don't think it was ever supposed to be on the scale of what it is now. Um, I think it got a little out of hand. They saw money signs when he became so popular, Mando. Um, but yeah. We got we got Mando or Star Wars, which has no hype. We got Invincible, which has hype, but horrible animation. And then we got Doomsday. We don't even know what's happening. But it's got so much hype, but it's got so much hype.

SPEAKER_01

Um yeah, and and the thing with movie theaters about quality control and stuff, I think it would be cool. I I don't know if we're close to it still, because they're still able to survive, but I would love to see a resurgence in single-owned uh theaters again. There are a few in the area that I'm at. Um, I mean they're decently far away still, and it's cool to see them. I would love to see more on a grander scale. Um, I think just like uh it's just like a single projector or a single screen, not necessarily a single screen, you could have multiple screens, but like a non-Regal or AMC owned theater. Yeah, that would be cool. Like I have been to the Harkins a few. That's uh one of the smaller brands that are out there, and they're very nice. Yeah um but I mean, even smaller than that, I think like because I I think that would be one of my dreams is to own a little theater. That'd be fun.

SPEAKER_00

That'd be cool.

SPEAKER_01

Um and revamp it and make it make it an experience because it is on the onus of the people that are running it to make it that experience. The movies they they can do their part, but yet everything surrounding it has to make it even more of the part. I think popcorn buckets are great. I mean, I have all my popcorn buckets back there. Uh they're so cool.

SPEAKER_00

Uh I mean I sent you that video, that video of those people in South Korea going to see the movies. Yeah, that was awesome. Those box seats, like they had like their own like special food and like people, waiters bringing it to you, and like I don't know.

SPEAKER_01

I think uh we have something like that here. Uh it's like a place where they actually have like places to eat and stuff inside. Sure.

SPEAKER_00

Like I've been to Cinnabar over with the yeah. Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah, but that's like you just sit there and they like kind of bring food to you, and even over here, our AMCs will um have places where you can get uh like food and like beer and like drinks and stuff, um which is kind of nice. Uh and then the Imagine that I went to for Project Hail Mary to see it on that IMAX. I don't know if Imagine's owned by AMC or anybody else or if they're their own thing. Um but anyways, they they were bringing food to people um that were in the theaters. Um you kind of just tell them your seat, and you know it's funny when we walked in there, we didn't like check in with anybody. We just had our our tickets on our phone and we just walked to our theater and found our seats and sat down. Like there wasn't no scanning or anything. It was interesting. But uh yeah, I think you're you're definitely a cinephile. You like you like the movie theater experience? You're you go a lot. Um I've kind of uh I think I'm very selective in what I see in the theaters just because I have lack of time. Yeah. Um but uh I don't know. I think movies are special. I think going to the movies is special. I can't wait to take Luke when he's old enough. Yeah, yeah. That'll be really cool. First movie he goes to. Um my nephew, I think. Star Wars first one. Yeah, I know, right? Hopefully Star Wars. Don't get me started. No, yeah, we already we already talked about it for 30 minutes.

SPEAKER_01

I know, I know. Uh we're we're rounded at a good spot. But I think this is a good episode. I I I had a good time talking about all this stuff.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I think we're pretty locked in on it, and we're we're having good c dialogue. Um, and I and I would love to hear from you, dear audience, dear listeners. Yes, what do you think? You can always message us on our individual platforms, uh comment below, like, subscribe, check us out on YouTube and Twitch if you want to watch us play some games. We're not as uh well spoken as we are on the podcast, of course.

SPEAKER_01

Um, but speak for yourself. I actually contemplated streaming today and then I ended up not doing it. I just enjoyed my quiet time.

SPEAKER_00

But maybe you can get back to your freaking Minecraft brother.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, you want me to get back to that? Yeah, or something. Maybe I'll move on to something else.

SPEAKER_00

Uh yeah, your 30-minute series, I think it could be you know, do your 30 minutes of Minecraft and then have like it on its own playlist. 30 minutes of um speed running. Wow.

SPEAKER_01

We could do plenty of things. Yeah, you got things. Yeah, but anyways, everybody, thank you for watching. Thank you. I think we could definitely talk more after the podcast, but we should let them get back to whatever they're doing, especially if they made it this far in the episode.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, we'll we release you. Um but yeah, not the droids you're looking for.

SPEAKER_01

I definitely want to hear from all of you and uh let us know what you're most excited about. So, uh I'm Yoslo. I'm Arma. And this is the Unknown Theories signing off. Peace!

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Kris Olsoy

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Taylor Olsoy

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